Did Steven Adler deserved to be fired?

[jujuhound]

I've read accounts on why Steven Adler was fired from Guns n Roses in 1990 but few of them make sense.  
You've got Slash/Duff/Axl's view: Steven couldn't quit using drugs.  He was high all the time which ruined his drumming.  He couldn't keep time at the sessions for the new album.  They gave him several chances to keep his job but he couldn't get straight.  

You've got Steven's side:  That he only developed a drug habit because of Slash/Duff/Izzy/Axl's influence.  He was desperately trying to clean to stay in the band.  And tried to work on "Use Your Illusion."  But he was taking methadone (or some drug withdrawal medication) which made him too out of it to play drums.  He said GnR fired him just before he was about to get clean and sober.  And that he didn't become a full blown junkie until after he left Guns N Roses.  

-  There's no doubt Steven Adler was strung out and liked to party.  As soon as Guns made it big he went on a 2 year bender.  But I'm not sure it effected his drumming.  If you listen to tapes from the Guns 1989 shows opening for the Stones he sounds fine.  The Matte Rehearsal demos show Adler in top form helping to arrange new Guns songs with Slash and Duff.  And at Farm Aid in the spring of 1990 his drumming seemed up to par to me.  (Granted he did trip on his way to the drum riser but he claims that was nerves).  And finally the release of "Civil War" in the summer of 1990 showed Steven still had his chops.  Even if the drum track was edited from "60 takes" as Axl later claimed.  

-  Anyway GnR claimed at the time that they used fill in drummers in the studio while Steven went to rehab.  Once Steven got out he immediately got high and was unable to keep time on the drums.  Steven claims he was struggling to get clean and taking anti-abuse type medication.  But his bandmates fired him before he had a chance.  

It's probably true Steven was in bad shape in the fall of 1990. Probably in no shape to record or tour.  Still GnR could have handled the situation differently.  I mean Slashl was his friend since they were 12.  Seemed unfair to fire him.  

Guns could have used a fill in drummer for the album and tour and gave Steven more time to clean up his act.  It was kind of hypocritical for Duff and Slash (who were both using drugs) to condemn Adler.  Then later they could have given Steven another chance to rejoin Guns.  Maybe play drums on the punk EP and join them for a short tour.  If by that time Steven was still playing "sloppy drums" they could fire him.  

But firing him for one slip didn't seem fair.  Steven was just a drug addict struggling to recover.  Relapses are part of the recovery process.  It probably wouldn't be that big deal but Steven's departure lead to Izzy leaving.  Matt Sorum's a great drummer.  But the band with Steven Adler had an amazing/unique sound.  

And Steven actually contributed to Use Your Illusion more than people remember.  He played on the original demos & helped arrange the drum patterns on Dust n Bones, Bad Apples, Don't Damn Me, The Garden, Garden Of Eden, Don't Cry, You Could Be Mine, Civil War, Locomotive, Back Off Bitch and Yesterdays.

[misterbrownstone]

no, Popcorn should still be in the band, or at least he should have been until Slash and Duff quit.

then Izzy wouldn't have quit from Axl's mass amount of power, and the entire band could've been together mabye.

[sunnyp]

I'm not too sure about the details of this but I seem to remember that Steven really messed up when he gave Erin Everly (axl's lady at the time) a snowball (heroin and cocaine together for the first time) and put her in hospital....... That may have added to friction in the gnr dressing room.

[bikaia]

Axl wasn't his friend since their were 12, slash was.
He OD 3 times before he got kicked, I read it somewhere.

[jujuhound]

I'm not too sure about the details of this but I seem to remember that Steven really messed up when he gave Erin Everly (axl's lady at the time) a snowball (heroin and cocaine together for the first time) and put her in hospital....... That may have added to friction in the gnr dressing room.

I read about that too.  Erin's family wanted to kill Steven but Axl intervened.  Afterwards though he wanted nothing to do with Adler.
Of course Erin Everly had some serious problem herself.  I'm sure Steven became the scapegoat for her own substance abuse problems... And how does someone force someone to do a speedball?  You have to inject it.   Granted Steven could have told her he was injecting her with cocaine and instead made it a coke/heroin combo.  (That's how John Belushi died)

Not to forgive Steven or blame Erin.  But don't junkies do stupid shit like that?  Nature of the disease.

[sunnyp]

I'm not too sure about the details of this but I seem to remember that Steven really messed up when he gave Erin Everly (axl's lady at the time) a snowball (heroin and cocaine together for the first time) and put her in hospital....... That may have added to friction in the gnr dressing room.

I read about that too.  Erin's family wanted to kill Steven but Axl intervened.  Afterwards though he wanted nothing to do with Adler.
Of course Erin Everly had some serious problem herself.  I'm sure Steven became the scapegoat for her own substance abuse problems... And how does someone force someone to do a speedball?  You have to inject it.   Granted Steven could have told her he was injecting her with cocaine and instead made it a coke/heroin combo.  (That's how John Belushi died)

Not to forgive Steven or blame Erin.  But don't junkies do stupid shit like that?  Nature of the disease.

Speedball..... Thats the one (snowball?!!) If someone spikes my drink and I found out about it before I became incapacitated/under the influence then I would beat 10 tonnes of shit out of them..... but if someone spiked me via injection then I dont know what I would do.

[jujuhound]

Speedball..... Thats the one (snowball?!!) If someone spikes my drink and I found out about it before I became incapacitated/under the influence then I would beat 10 tonnes of shit out of them..... but if someone spiked me via injection then I dont know what I would do.

Yeah a "snowball" is a totally different form of depravity all  together!  :eek:
(Don't know if you've ever seen that movie 'Clerks' but they explain what a snowball is.  I'm not gonna go into the nasty details here.)  

[sunnyp]

Yeah, now that I make an effort to remember what a snowball is it is pretty disgusting, not as bad as felching though....... Freudian slip. Shows where my mind is at.

[chinese_democracy_]

no drugs are for idiots and thats what he was

[SONOFABITCH]

I am such an old school fan, that GNR to me will always be the original band with Steven.  I never even really accepted Matt Sorum.  I wish Steven could have gotten help and they could have proceeded with him.  He must have been difficult to work with.

[girlincarwithgnr]

He was fired from the band in 1990 when he was unable to competently record on the Use Your Illusion I & Use Your Illusion II albums with the band as a result of his drug addiction.~ Wall, Mick



Adler was fired from the group (replaced by former Cult drummer Matt Sorum), and slid even deeper into drug abuse, resulting in such health problems as a heart attack and a pair of strokes. Adler has made several attempts at re-entering the rock world since his exit from G N' R, with such obscure outfits as Freaks in the Room and a new version of Road Crew, as well as a brief spell as the drummer for '80s Van Halen-disciples the Bulletboys. Adler's biggest publicity during the '90s wasn't musically based, however -- as he successfully sued G N' R for "wrongful termination," as well as doing jail time for assaulting two women (in separate cases). By the early 21st century, Adler was supposedly at work on a book detailing his tenure with Guns N' Roses (with a working title of No Bed of Roses), playing shows with different L.A. bands, and trying to get the ball rolling for a reunion of the original Guns lineup. ~ Greg Prato, All Music Guide

[Kiedis]

no, Popcorn should still be in the band, or at least he should have been until Slash and Duff quit.

then Izzy wouldn't have quit from Axl's mass amount of power, and the entire band could've been together mabye.

yep. was nonsense to fire him, and the UYI's would have sounded better with him.

[Bugaboo]

just listen to Steven on don't cry. Wayyyy better. Mattt was weak.

[girlincarwithgnr]

no, Popcorn should still be in the band, or at least he should have been until Slash and Duff quit.

then Izzy wouldn't have quit from Axl's mass amount of power, and the entire band could've been together mabye.

yep. was nonsense to fire him, and the UYI's would have sounded better with him.

Well, if you're unable to competently record on the Use Your Illusion I & Use Your Illusion II albums with the band as a result of his drug addiction,
bye bye. They tried to help him but were unsuccesful.

Or would you have rather have waited longer for the release of the Illusions because he was being rehabilitating?

[wyldechild]

well I think he deserved to be fired... I dont think they fired him just for fun



   

[miles_anselmo]

steven can't drum    

[mooney]

Did steven deserve to be fired?




Yes.

[2NaFish]

popcorn's gone? aww jeez. he was my fave.

hope they get someone good to replace him.

[Kiedis]

no, Popcorn should still be in the band, or at least he should have been until Slash and Duff quit.

then Izzy wouldn't have quit from Axl's mass amount of power, and the entire band could've been together mabye.

yep. was nonsense to fire him, and the UYI's would have sounded better with him.

Well, if you're unable to competently record on the Use Your Illusion I & Use Your Illusion II albums with the band as a result of his drug addiction,
bye bye. They tried to help him but were unsuccesful.

Or would you have rather have waited longer for the release of the Illusions because he was being rehabilitating?

absolutely, firing a BANDMEMBER cos they're in a hurry to put out an album is insane.
Axl took his sweet time on the album anyways. if he had used a little less time tinkering around, they would have made the same release date with Steve on drums.

firing a bandmember is stupid in any situation.

[eddiesson]

Steven's dismissal lead to izzy's departure? err... you may have a point, but even than, it will be only a small portion of the whole thing.