North Korea goes Nuclear

[Chinese N' Democracy]

Something that concerns me most...Innocent lives and pollution...I mean...nuclear wastes can only be "wasted" by being sent to outerspace (another measure of the world using nuclear energy in a near future, not tommorrow, though) and all the innocente lives...well I mean, for those of u who don't know this, in Costa Rica we have no army. We believe in freedom and life as an individual right every single creature in this Earth has. Can you imagine what it'd be that (for example) Sladdi's mom was on Asia and they throw the nuke? I mean, as far as I know, she ain't fuckin involved, but she'll get killed!!. If soldiers die, that's a little bit ok cause they are serving their country and they are there, ready to give their lives but, really, kids, pregnant women, babies, old people...they should not be involved. Fighting is ok, but as long as we don't involve 2nd parties into our problem. Then again, did this ever matter for a president like George Bush? Looking for oil into the desert...killing people with no mercy...destroying schools, orphanatories, elder homes...I mean...really, when I turn the TV and I watch CNN...for me it's like reviving 9/11 but...the towers being people...we are humans...all of us...this...just ain't fair!!

[Slashist]

Sure about that?

pretty sure

[Badman]

pretty sure

Don't be. They always come home.

[sunnyp]

I dont think he is stupid enough to use the weapons unless provoked. Like anyone else it is MAD.

He is now a major player in the world because he is now sitting at the same table as the most powerful: 'The Nuclear Table'. N Korea is now the 9th member.

Suppressing countries from reaching this table of power could be viewed as bullying by not wanting to relinquish relative power and authority, while it could also be viewed as maintaining world stability. Personally, I think its a bit of both.

Hmm, I don't think it is in anyway bullying.  Here's why:
The United States is far from the only nation involved.  The united kingdom, france, and Russia(almost, though not completley) completely support heavy sanctions on North Korea.  China is also on the verge of complying with whatever the united states has to choose.  The tough thing about this is China controls something like 70% of the oil and 40% of the food that is practically donated to north korea.  If China(and it's really looking like they will)get involved we will cut off absolutley everything there is to North Korea.  Every ship will be inspected and all North Korean bacnk accounts will be frozen.  

There are problems with this plan however:
When we do this, we essentially strangle N. Korea.  They can either give up peacefully(maybe, but I'm thinkin, "yeah, right") or they can fight back.
Also, Russia and China are looking at this blockade apprehensively considering vladivostock and many chinese ports will also be blockaded and inspected.

And, if you haven't noticed every country which I have just listed is.... the P5!  So, no matter what they want to do as long as they are together it's probably going to fly.

Anyhow, MAD is not reason enough for north korea to not use nuclear arms.  MAD is effective when dealing with reasonable powers such as the USSR and the USA during the cold war.  North Korea doesn't care they clearly just want to be a pain in the worlds ass.  Kim Jong Il and Kim Il Sung are clearly no different.  North Korea has sustained being almost the poorest fucking country in the world as they are/were some of the richest men in the world.

Also, the #1 reason why it is not bullying is to prevent a Eastern Asia arms race.  Guess who wants em now?  Japan, Taiwan, South Korea.... the list goes on.  This would be absolutley horrible to bring nuclear weapons back to the table.  However, China doesn't foresee that happening.  China will try to help out in anyway in order to end this before it spreads and stay the only nuclear 'threat' in eastern asia.  Threat in quotations because they are a reasonable country.

Your argument fails to convince me. It still seems to me that nuclear nations try and stop other nations from becoming nuclear because then they will have to approach them completely differently. Nuclear nations can no longer treat N Korea as some 'pain in the ass' country as you put it, because now they have the capabilities to demand respect.

I think you have probably misunderstood me because your no.1 reason completely contradicts what you are trying say and actually proves my point completely.

[ageisler18]

Your argument fails to convince me. It still seems to me that nuclear nations try and stop other nations from becoming nuclear because then they will have to approach them completely differently. Nuclear nations can no longer treat N Korea as some 'pain in the ass' country as you put it, because now they have the capabilities to demand respect.

I think you have probably misunderstood me because your no.1 reason completely contradicts what you are trying say and actually proves my point completely.

Well, I only really made one point and that was the last one.  I was porviding background information cause no one seems to know what the hell they are talking about.  The most important thing is to prevent an eastern asia arms race.  This would fuck up the world unbelievably and not just north korea would be a porblem

[sunnyp]

You worried the japanese are gonna take revenge for Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

I believe that trouble often finds people that look for it. Look at why countries like Holland, Ireland, Portugal never get attacked. Because they dont stick their noses other people's business.

Bossing the world by saying who is entitled to nuclear technology will only end in more reasons to attack your oppressors.

'If you live by the sword then be prepared to die by the sword'

[Slashist]

this is a good article on the subject, sunnyp, i think you'll like it

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1160689837230&call_pageid=970599119419

[sunnyp]

this is a good article on the subject, sunnyp, i think you'll like it

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1160689837230&call_pageid=970599119419

It was a good read. Thanks bro.

I always like to see how different countries newspapers portray the situation.

Over here in the UK the media isn't giving a crap about NK, its focusing on China, Russia and America's response more than anything.

[ageisler18]

You worried the japanese are gonna take revenge for Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

Is that serious question?  Oh my god... hahaha you have to be joking.  Do you know anthing about what happened after that?  I can't even respond to this.  Japan is ABSOLUTLEY not going to attack us.  Japan techinically doesn't have a military.  After hiroshima and nagasaki we rebuilt them, their government, their army and have completely reconstructed them into the 2nd or 3rd largest GDP in the entire world.  Sooooo despite their booming economy ,they can't do anything. Even if they did, japan would be straight under water; Their not that fucking stupid.

No one is going to bomb america.  Period.  It's that simple I'm not worried about america in this situation.  The bomb will be shot out of the air by three defense systems we have to do so and portions of our 5000 nukes will be on their doorsteps.

I am, however, worried about Japan.  North Korea hates Japan.  If north korea so much as launches a nuke over japan into the ocean, Japan is willing to do everything in its power to then create nukes despite America being displeased.  Now guess what'll happen???  Taiwan wants nukes.  Taiwan and China HATE one another where do you think this one is going to lead.  And don't forget about south korea and it's nuclear neighbor!!!!!  Soon it spreads to the middle east and eventually the rest of the world.  At that point nuclear war becomes inevitable and the devestation of earth becomes a reality. How can you tell me that the world is better off with nukes????

[nemo]

nukes will be on their doorsteps.

I am, however, worried about Japan.  North Korea hates Japan.  If north korea so much as launches a nuke over japan into the ocean, Japan is willing to do everything in its power to then create nukes despite America being displeased.  

Japan would never do anything towards becoming a nuclear power, they are the most anti-nuclear country in the world, and the revulsion they feel for them is so deeply ingrained into their national psyche that I don't think anything, even another nation launching a nuclear weapon at them again would ever convince them to change their minds.  If there's one country you don't need to worry about ever entering into the nuclear arms race, it's Japan

[sunnyp]

Is that serious question?  Oh my god... hahaha you have to be joking.  Do you know anthing about what happened after that?  I can't even respond to this.  Japan is ABSOLUTLEY not going to attack us.  Japan techinically doesn't have a military.  After hiroshima and nagasaki we rebuilt them, their government, their army and have completely reconstructed them into the 2nd or 3rd largest GDP in the entire world.  Sooooo despite their booming economy ,they can't do anything. Even if they did, japan would be straight under water; Their not that fucking stupid.

No one is going to bomb america.  Period.  It's that simple I'm not worried about america in this situation.  The bomb will be shot out of the air by three defense systems we have to do so and portions of our 5000 nukes will be on their doorsteps.

I am, however, worried about Japan.  North Korea hates Japan.  If north korea so much as launches a nuke over japan into the ocean, Japan is willing to do everything in its power to then create nukes despite America being displeased.  Now guess what'll happen???  Taiwan wants nukes.  Taiwan and China HATE one another where do you think this one is going to lead.  And don't forget about south korea and it's nuclear neighbor!!!!!  Soon it spreads to the middle east and eventually the rest of the world.  At that point nuclear war becomes inevitable and the devestation of earth becomes a reality. How can you tell me that the world is better off with nukes????

Woah there. The bit about Hiroshima and Nagasaki was only a joke dude.

But I hope it highlighted the fact that to date the US are still the only nation to have used nuclear weapons on civilian populations in war.

You are right, nobody would bomb America but not for want of trying. You so far away from anybody that the missiles would drop in the oceans. Presently NK's missile can hit China, Russia and some shitty piece of ice in Alaska. John Bolton can continue his sanctions of import/export inspections knowing that America will never feel the NK backlash.  

I have not once said that nuclear weapons are a good idea. I also think that you are getting a bit ahead yourself with the dooma and gloom prophecies in your final paragraph.

Peace.