Author Topic: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists  (Read 769 times)

Offline ©GnrPersia

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Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« on: February 10, 2009, 05:04:36 PM »


Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
By DAVID CARR
Published: February 8, 2009


It appears that Live Nation and Ticketmaster Entertainment are about to attempt a merger. Gee, what a great idea: Let's take two behemoths with an overwhelming footprint in the live music business, smush them together, and see how that works out for the consumer.

Given the regulatory hurdles that the merger is bound to confront, it didn't help their prospects that, on the same day, Bruce Springsteen posted an open letter to his fans accusing Ticketmaster of "a clear conflict of interest" in directing fans to a sister company, TicketsNow, that resells tickets at a huge markup.

"The abuse of our fans and our trust by Ticketmaster has made us as furious as it has made many of you," Mr. Springsteen wrote. Irving Azoff, the chief executive of Ticketmaster, issued an apology and promised refunds. (Would you want the Boss testifying in front of Congress against your merger? Me neither.)



Fans moan that rock music is not what it used to be, but the business landscape behind all the amplifiers has changed even more drastically. The corporate version of the live music business is becoming a land of giants, which at Live Nation is built on so-called 360 deals with the likes of Madonna, U2 and Jay-Z, in which contracts give the promoter a percentage of revenue generated by live performance, merchandise and, sometimes, recorded music. Ticketmaster, through its Front Line division, has ties with Aerosmith, the Eagles and Guns N' Roses.

If the prospect of a single company mounting a Guns n' Madonna tour worries you, it also concerns some in the business. Via e-mail, Tom Morello, the guitarist in Rage Against the Machine, told me that a Ticketmaster-Live Nation merger could have huge consequences.

"Fewer and fewer gatekeepers mean fewer choices and higher prices for fans," he wrote. "One huge monolith means no choice at all. Fans and artists must develop some organized counterweight quickly or resign themselves to their fate."

A pretty grim forecast. Then on Thursday, a new CD by Jill Sobule arrived in the mail. "The California Years, Vol. 1" is a wonderful record, but the back story is just as good and a reminder that in among the giants, new models are emerging.

Ms. Sobule is a Denver native, a singer-songwriter who has been in the business for more than two decades and is probably best known for her 1995 song, "I Kissed a Girl." In that time, she has been signed and dropped by two major labels and had two independent labels sign her, then go belly up.

Reluctant to go the label route again, she posted a question in a blog on allthingsd.com, the digital technology site owned by Dow Jones:

"How do I pay the rent?"

After listening to her fans, she came up with an updated version of the Medici model. To raise the $75,000 she needed for an album, she set up a Web site — jillsnextrecord.com — in which her fans would serve as patrons for her next record in return for various rewards.

Ten bucks earned them a digital download of the record, $50 an advance copy and a thank you in the liner notes, while $1,000 got them a personalized theme song written by the artist. Three people who paid $5,000 had Ms. Sobule play at their house. The person who gave $10,000 sang on the record.

If it sounds cheesy, like a virtual Tupperware party, consider that the record was produced by Don Was, who has produced Bob Dylan and the Rolling Stones. The sessions, recorded in Hollywood at Henson Recording Studios, were available for streaming and comment on Ms. Sobule's Web site before she chose the final songs. (One listener's verdict? More cowbell, please.)

Reached at the TED conference (Technology, Education, Design) in Palm Springs — Ms. Sobule is that rare plugged-in folkie — she said her version of digital busking had real benefits.

"I have never received a single cent on a record that I have ever made," she said, because sales never seemed to pay back the money she owed for an advance. "With all of this talk of new models and all of these big companies like Clear Channel and Live Nation trying to figure out a way to make a buck, this is one thing that makes sense for an artist like me. I have a small group of fans, but they are mighty."

Ms. Sobule said that while the top of the business is busy finding ways to own more and more of what seems to be a shrinking pie, artists like her were tunneling their way to a direct route with their public. In a sense, the diminution in value of the CD has allowed musicians to re-examine what a contract with a label or a promoter really means.

A year ago, Ms. Sobule sold thumb drives to people at her shows and gave them a password so that within a week, they could download a version of the live show. "The people who come to your shows are going to want to share an experience, to have something to remember, and it just makes sense that you give them that kind of opportunity."

Ms. Sobule is less the tech evangelist than a working musician who likes what she does. Jillsnextrecord.com is not always as earnest as it sounds: It offered a $500 "Gold" level of donation in which your name was to be sung at the end of the record, but also a cheeky "Gold Doubloons Level": "Exactly like the gold level, but you give me more money."

"I am never going to be a top 10, MTV person at this stage of my career, but this approach allowed me to make a record that I am proud of and I don't owe anybody," she said, and then corrected herself. "I still owe about 10 people theme songs."

E-mail: carr@nytimes.com
note:A version of this article appeared in print on February 9, 2009, on page B1 of the New York edition.


Source: New York Times
Photo: © George Chin www.georgechin.com



AdeL


Offline ShePoutsHerBest

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2009, 05:37:27 PM »
I have never seen that pic before, from what I hear he really sucked on nightrain
IT IS REALLY HAPPENING!

Offline shackler

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2009, 12:37:39 PM »
I've never seen that pic either, is that kid rock

Offline ©GnrPersia

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2009, 01:34:30 PM »
I have never seen that pic before, from what I hear he really sucked on nightrain
PM me if you want to know about the source

I've never seen that pic either, is that kid rock

yes he's kidrock

Offline shackler

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2009, 09:55:01 AM »
I've never seen Kid Rock perform with Axlllll when did this happen or is this some joke I feel like an idiot

Offline Bane

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2009, 09:58:34 AM »
Didnt you know? Kid Rock replaced Tracy and Roberta as the backup singer

Offline anythinggoes

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2009, 10:18:38 AM »
I've never seen Kid Rock perform with Axlllll when did this happen or is this some joke I feel like an idiot


Hammerstien 2006, Final Night i belive

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ve5Jx5xbKo&feature=related[/youtube]
oh wont you please take me home

Offline Iconic Shawn

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2009, 10:24:41 AM »
Greeeeeeed.  Its the worst.
A lot of people in and out of the government are trying to stop this. I hope they succeed.

~S~

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2009, 11:07:09 AM »
I was at that show with kid rock there.   also yea they best stop it.  look its bad enuff. Ticketmaster plus clear channel plus mtv and right wing pointing wigheads have successfully ruined our music experience.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2009, 11:22:27 AM by Sean »
What are your current thoughts about Kurt Cobain?

Axl: I said I'm going on ChiDem now and he said whatever & walked away other than that I've been busy.

Offline Iconic Shawn

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2009, 11:34:41 AM »
I was at that show with kid rock there.   also yea they best stop it.  look its bad enuff. Ticketmaster plus clear channel plus mtv and right wing pointing wigheads have successfully ruined our music experience.

Explain the Right Wing wigheads part?

~S~

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2009, 11:41:39 AM »
Explain the Right Wing wigheads part?

~S~

are you even kidding me now that u haven't got the faintest what I'm talking about?  TAxi's are yellow too
What are your current thoughts about Kurt Cobain?

Axl: I said I'm going on ChiDem now and he said whatever & walked away other than that I've been busy.

Offline Iconic Shawn

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2009, 12:21:57 PM »
are you even kidding me now that u haven't got the faintest what I'm talking about?  TAxi's are yellow too

Actually yeah. No idea.

~S~

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2009, 01:15:56 PM »
I always loved that song...

that landfill of ET cartridges is about to have a best friend named Chinese Democracy.-James Lofton

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2009, 01:33:00 AM »
Actually yeah. No idea.

~S~

to not even scratch the surface.  :rolleyes: CC is republican run >> campaign donations and ties to Bush Administration and other republican agenda >> ties in to promises of forced washed down music and family friendly shit music >> ties into with banks also who holds seats in both those boards of banks and CC = more promises and safe advertising = $$$$$$$$$$$$  at the price for shit music, controlled airplay, controlled advertising = safe $$$$$$$$$$

CC has on its board people from the highest positions from the republican party and members of R congress.  Not to mention Tom Hicks projects.

all about kickbacks and yea I agree its a greeeeedy black hole
What are your current thoughts about Kurt Cobain?

Axl: I said I'm going on ChiDem now and he said whatever & walked away other than that I've been busy.

Offline axlrose4eva

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2009, 02:01:13 AM »
to not even scratch the surface.  :rolleyes: CC is republican run >> campaign donations and ties to Bush Administration and other republican agenda >> ties in to promises of forced washed down music and family friendly shit music >> ties into with banks also who holds seats in both those boards of banks and CC = more promises and safe advertising = $$$$$$$$$$$$  at the price for shit music, controlled airplay, controlled advertising = safe $$$$$$$$$$

CC has on its board people from the highest positions from the republican party and members of R congress.  Not to mention Tom Hicks projects.

all about kickbacks and yea I agree its a greeeeedy black hole

Sean speaks the truth... CC is a bunch of right wing conservative cunts who try and control are lives. Republicans shit are/were so outta hand its fucking annoying.

"Open your eyes and dont be blind, cant you see we're two of a kind"

Offline L!VE FREE!

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2009, 02:18:20 AM »
Bleh, you can point fingers and make judgments about intentions.
There are certain things back decades ago that you could point and say "oh the man did this...the man did that".
In some ways, things are better, in some ways things are worse. There was never a "golden era" to be a musician.

One could easily argue (from whatever perspective) that since our society has developed and technology has vastly improved, we've convenience/high-speed lifestyle for values/norms and an overall focus. What's that term again? Anomie? Overall, society is very scattered, no clear direction, which fucks up the musical scene pretty good as well as produces a lot of self-taught "experts" which lead to a diminished importance of music as a function in society.

There's always going to be "big music". It's role will be vastly diminished until there's one "Wal-Mart" company standing. It seems like that Live Nation will dominate that market. On the positive, artists can retain most or all of their profit while becoming self-automating and dependent of big business. However this is done with the snail-like speed of progress. It's hard to mix a record properly. It's hard to be self-automating. It's hard to gain a large fanbase without outside help and a large budget. So in short, one shouldn't demonize big business. Live Nation isn't Wal-Mart, it's not fucking up the economy. The bigger big business gets, the larger the gap between them and the common people and the greater the possibility for the rebels/kids to do "their own thing" like Sean Fanning did with Napster, etc., etc. So in a way, we NEED a big corporate giant.

The goal is still to be "a big rock band" that makes great music, they just want to change the means of getting there.
So it's an interesting time in music, yes, but at the same time it's a scary and boring time in music. Artists with money from a gone era like GN'R, etc., need to be leading the charge into this new era. But then again, the trouble is the issue of focus. Or lack thereof....

Where do we go from here? Do we give music out free? Why? What's wrong with paying for music? Okay, $10 is too much for a CD, fair enough. But what's the price? Who sets the price? Why should I pay X dollars for a CD I don't know will be good? Because a lack of values?

There are a lot of questions to be answered, but one thing that is definite and for certain: FANS WANT ACCESS and DIALOGUE with the ARTISTS. No, NEED access with their favorite artists. Not only is it a fruitful business model, but it is good for the overall health of music. The more self-automating bands become, the more they need to rely on their fanbase.

So maybe it's the Vodka on the Rocks, but this seems long winded. I need to organize some of this shit, but I think there's some wisdom in there somewhere.

« Last Edit: February 13, 2009, 02:22:57 AM by L!VE FREE! »

Goodbye, Blue Sky......... Goodbye.

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Re: Big Music vs. Fans and Artists
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2009, 02:30:31 AM »
 :D live.... lol  you lost a lil on exactly which point you were addressing.  but man you know that the hardest working and best talent 99.9 % of the time cannot pierce thru this great greed we have now. It was better years ago for sure and more open minded and at least they kept in mind the fans a little bit within the whole corruption of things. Now they legally brought it all together with many people in high places and its the britney wall of china now. generally speaking
« Last Edit: February 13, 2009, 02:45:24 AM by Sean »
What are your current thoughts about Kurt Cobain?

Axl: I said I'm going on ChiDem now and he said whatever & walked away other than that I've been busy.

 



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