Oslo Bombing

[Sean]

btw, what holiday was it there

Friday -  is the only thing I heard is that the first floors were mostly empty because "people left early to start the weekend". 

[sunnyp]

you've taken polar's comment out of context here. more people probably should have died than did - fortunately not though. As for the confusion over sean's use of the emoticon, clearly that was intended at the politician/mayor and not the incident itself. though your point about someone with a weaker grasp of english misunderstanding it may have some validity.

Absolutely not. That quote was just plain clumsy. Some people on this forum really need to spend more time thinking about the connotation, meaning and interpretation of their entries before posting.

Again, a less capable person with the language might interpret that as "it would have been a good idea to kill more people" instead of "I am surprised more people weren't killed". An advanced level English speaker from another country simply does not understand the difference between the two (I know, I teach academic English to foreign university students). That distinction is made at a very high level.

It doesn't matter what the context is, you don't put fucking laughing icons or write shit like that when they're still taking a body count. End of story.   

[Rocket Queen]

Anyone heard from RQ?

Reading the eyewitness reports on the shootings is horrific.

The gunman was supposed to be some kind of freemason, right wing christian fundamentalist? WTF is wrong with these assholes?

I arrived on Norwegian soil around midnight. I was met by 4 police officers (we were mostly Europeans off 1 single Boeing 737 arriving from Southern France, very small airport) checking our passports (Norwegian Passport holders) and redirecting foreign passport holders to a different security zone. For those who don't know...normally when traveling withing the EU  zone (EUS) you only show your passport/EU Identity card when checking in your departure country, not wherever you are going. You just pick up any luggage and/or walk out of the airport. They are not officially searching for anyone internationally, but it's an extra security measure (mostly for us to feel safe imo).

Anyhow, it was strange to come back to this mess, we were stuck in traffic out of Oslo, didn't move for an hour, all the radio stations had changed their program to include hourly updates on the situation. Our King, Prime Minister & several other officials have spoken both on the news and to the families & friends of the victims.

93 total died. Attack was planned for over 9 years.

What I don't understand is this;

In Norway police CANNOT be armed UNLESS it has been confirmed that there is an armed person at "the scene". Armed police NEVER comes alone. What people that don't know much about Norway need to know; it is strictly a gunfree society, we don't see guns, police cannot carry guns, it is hard to obtain a license to own guns. Where you see most arms is in the hunting environment, you of course need a license there as well. It is normal that young people are not as aware of this, but the ADULTS that transported him should at least have checked his ID card/raised an eyebrow on his massive weapon and the fact that he was alone.

What happened on UTOYA (the island where 83 were killed) is that he (Anders) got on a ferry, with a MACHINE GUN, ALONE, dressed as a cop, without an identity badge (all police must wear official identity cards around their neck) and was transported calmly to the island.

There has been reports of someone present at the island (who was about to go to the police academy) that found this man suspicious. Of course because he was clearly armed and alone. THIS NEVER HAPPENS and it not allowed to happen.

'The terrorist' called out to the youth on the island upon arrival (this was shortly after the bomb in Oslo, so people probably expected police) "everyone, gather here, you are safe, I'm here to help you" (roughly) before he started to shoot wildly at everyone.

This is messy, but also @SEAN. In Norway we(working people) have summer vacation at the same time (mostly) last three weeks of July. THEREFOR it would have been "worse" if the bomb hit during a regular day outside of this period. HOWEVER he chose this time because of the Youth Labor Party camp that was being held during this weekend.

Luckily my friends are OK. I feel for all the families and friends of the victims, this is a tiny country, everyone knows someone who knows someone who have felt this close to them.

What makes me proud of voting for our prime minister? This;

Bush, 9/11: “We’re gonna hunt you down”


Stoltenberg (P.M), 7/22: “We will retaliate with more democracy­”

 

[Sean]

lost for words RQ.   ((((cyber hugs)))) 

I been anxiously awaiting one of my best buds, Ole, from Oslo.  He was on vacation in an island here and comes back to Athens today. He's been living back n forth from there to here.... his gal is Greek.  Going to invite him out for a beer. Same with Martin who is my best bud in Athens from Copenhagen we made a date for tomorrow as he has a lot of friends from the area that seem accounted for so far.   just stick all together and you know.

Your words painted a wider picture than what I been seeing....  thanks.

[2NaFish]

thanks for your words rq.

[Rocket Queen]

lost for words RQ.   ((((cyber hugs)))) 

I been anxiously awaiting one of my best buds, Ole, from Olso.  He was on vacation in an island here and comes back to Athens today. He's been living back n forth from there to here.... his gal is Greek.  Going to invite him out for a beer. Same with Martin who is my best bud in Athens from Copenhagen we made a date for tomorrow as he has a lot of friends from the area that seem accounted for so far.   just stick all together and you know.

Your words painted a wider picture than what I been seeing....  thanks.

N.P!

Hope all is well with your friends and their families.

I am going to Oslo tomorrow, it will be strange.

[bucketsixx]

Thanks for the insight RQ. Had no idea about the police not carrying guns. Very strange/unfortunate that no one questioned the guy before it got to this.

Stoltenberg (P.M), 7/22: “We will retaliate with more democracy­”

That's a great quote right there!

[sunnyp]

I arrived on Norwegian soil around midnight. I was met by 4 police officers (we were mostly Europeans off 1 single Boeing 737 arriving from Southern France, very small airport) checking our passports (Norwegian Passport holders) and redirecting foreign passport holders to a different security zone. For those who don't know...normally when traveling withing the EU  zone (EUS) you only show your passport/EU Identity card when checking in your departure country, not wherever you are going. You just pick up any luggage and/or walk out of the airport. They are not officially searching for anyone internationally, but it's an extra security measure (mostly for us to feel safe imo).

Anyhow, it was strange to come back to this mess, we were stuck in traffic out of Oslo, didn't move for an hour, all the radio stations had changed their program to include hourly updates on the situation. Our King, Prime Minister & several other officials have spoken both on the news and to the families & friends of the victims.

93 total died. Attack was planned for over 9 years.

What I don't understand is this;

In Norway police CANNOT be armed UNLESS it has been confirmed that there is an armed person at "the scene". Armed police NEVER comes alone. What people that don't know much about Norway need to know; it is strictly a gunfree society, we don't see guns, police cannot carry guns, it is hard to obtain a license to own guns. Where you see most arms is in the hunting environment, you of course need a license there as well. It is normal that young people are not as aware of this, but the ADULTS that transported him should at least have checked his ID card/raised an eyebrow on his massive weapon and the fact that he was alone.

What happened on UTOYA (the island where 83 were killed) is that he (Anders) got on a ferry, with a MACHINE GUN, ALONE, dressed as a cop, without an identity badge (all police must wear official identity cards around their neck) and was transported calmly to the island.

There has been reports of someone present at the island (who was about to go to the police academy) that found this man suspicious. Of course because he was clearly armed and alone. THIS NEVER HAPPENS and it not allowed to happen.

'The terrorist' called out to the youth on the island upon arrival (this was shortly after the bomb in Oslo, so people probably expected police) "everyone, gather here, you are safe, I'm here to help you" (roughly) before he started to shoot wildly at everyone.

This is messy, but also @SEAN. In Norway we(working people) have summer vacation at the same time (mostly) last three weeks of July. THEREFOR it would have been "worse" if the bomb hit during a regular day outside of this period. HOWEVER he chose this time because of the Youth Labor Party camp that was being held during this weekend.

Luckily my friends are OK. I feel for all the families and friends of the victims, this is a tiny country, everyone knows someone who knows someone who have felt this close to them.

What makes me proud of voting for our prime minister? This;

Bush, 9/11: “We’re gonna hunt you down”


Stoltenberg (P.M), 7/22: “We will retaliate with more democracy­”

 

Looking back in hindsight, it must seem so obvious. However, it often takes a special kind of person to challenge authority. Stanley Milgram's psychological tests in the 1960's show that most people accept authority even when it is being abused. The fact that he was wearing a uniform and was heavily-armed probably reinforced people's opinions about him being a police officer rather than question it.

From this shocking turn of events, it is clear that the Norwegian people are strong in character. Take care and be strong.

Alex Palmer, London, UK.   

[Rocket Queen]

Thanks for the insight RQ. Had no idea about the police not carrying guns. Very strange/unfortunate that no one questioned the guy before it got to this.

That's a great quote right there!

Indeed. People are handling it great as well.

Looking back in hindsight, it must seem so obvious. However, it often takes a special kind of person to challenge authority. Stanley Milgram's psychological tests in the 1960's show that most people accept authority even when it is being abused. The fact that he was wearing a uniform and was heavily-armed probably reinforced people's opinions about him being a police officer rather than question it.

From this shocking turn of events, it is clear that the Norwegian people are strong in character. Take care and be strong.

Alex Palmer, London, UK.   

There is a psychological term for this that I cannot remember atm. People see something happen and afterwards think "of course!". But I never said it was obvious, in fact I said that it is normal that younger people wouldn't see what is wrong with this.

But I think you missed the most important point; we are a gunless society. If we see guns in public we are shocked, feel unsafe, weary. Most people over the age of 18 will know this very well. You never see police in singles carry guns, in fact, I can not remember EVER seeing Norwegian police carry guns. NEVER. This is why I think that someone along the way should at least have raised an eyebrow, an adult should have looked closer. Of course they didn't, and this happens. It makes no sense at all that 1 man that is heavily armed takes a ferry out to an island full of people attending a Youth Labour Party camp. 1: Norway has a long coast line and our police forces are in possession of many police boats. 2: I cannot stress this enough, police don't operate alone, or with guns, unless it is confirmed that there is a compelling reason for this.

I am not blaming anyone but Anders Brehvik. I am just trying to understand how this could happen, I believe that catastrophes and accidents happen due to a series of mistakes that can be avoided. Most of the time. Often they're not cached soon enough, and it is of course not simple to do so, which is what happened here. Norwegians are a very trusting people that trust our government and police, I also think this facilitated the process of getting to the island.

[2NaFish]

Anders Breivik will be tried in a closed court. Whilst i can understand this i think it's important part of the democratic and grief process for this to be done in a (secure) public setting. Its certainly important not to 'glamorize' (see below) the killer in the media but the court's should remain open.

Charlie Brooker - News creates panic about German killer

[polar]

this guy is still the worst terrorist ever.  he bombed empty buildings.  that alone raises a bunch of red flags.  also, he did it on a friday, that's the worst time to break news if you're trying to make the news cycles worldwide.  the ultimate sin was doing it on the same weekend an english pop star dies.  nothing distracts the public's attention away from dead children than an overdose of a marginally talented musician at the magic age of 27


PS nevermind i just read he was trying to kill the PM

[2NaFish]

this guy is still the worst terrorist ever.  he bombed empty buildings.  that alone raises a bunch of red flags.  also, he did it on a friday, that's the worst time to break news if you're trying to make the news cycles worldwide.  the ultimate sin was doing it on the same weekend an english pop star dies.  nothing distracts the public's attention away from dead children than an overdose of a marginally talented musician at the magic age of 27


PS nevermind i just read he was trying to kill the PM

that and, unless he killed winehouse, it was done before her death was known.

[2NaFish]

paul's already dead.

It's kind of a split for front page news right now between tabloid and broadsheets on what they're running with, but the Winehouse story has got legs whereas the grown-up papers will move on to something new (or back to phone hacking more likely). Britain is in a horrific state whenever someone young dies in that the media attempts to out grieve itself in comparison to Diana. I'd say its a shame that the norwegian deaths arent highlighted more but given the usual treatment to mass murderers, as explained above, its probably best they'll just prattle on about the lost 'genius'.

[Sean]

hard to calculate indeed.  Had my beers with Martin just now.....  he says in Denmark the cops use these little guns that won't kill you.  It might break glass though.  He's doing ok and treated him to some cz beers. He was surprised a little when I told him RQ's view of police don't carry guns at all usually for Norway.  He has no understanding why he would shoot his own people.

ps. @sunnyp.... I said God bless mainly becuzz I thought you were from the region and/or hurt in some way ----  ...  in retrospect after you told me 'fuck you' after a blessing, your views made no sense to me as I have many friends from Nordic region & have higher intelligence than you might think. Now that I know you are from UK .....  Its more apparent you are a poop sucking attention whore that had his philosophies blown who couldn't point at America on this one.  I don't care who you are... an administrator, gov. official, the president of something, a gutter slut or attention whore.  I'm telling you from human to human .....  hope you get your stuff together. Stop leeching onto others.  I post on this site as a regular member. I don't ban people for telling me to fuck off etc etc.....   Not once have I flashed a badge at you. Stop being a pussy.